The Haiku Foundation Forums

Thank you very much Sir for your insights. It is very helpful in understanding the flavor of haiku in different regions.

Quote from: AlanSummers on December 31, 2019, 07:50:41 AM
Look forward to people replying to this question!

Yes, the USA introduced more and more emotion into their haiku, while perhaps British (England, Wales, Scotland) might be less subjective, with much less emotion. 

Japanese haiku (1890s onwards) is varied, with multiple schools, from basic shasei (stage 1) through stages 2 & 3. Many are similar to hokku and other haikai verses pre-1890s and would include a classic, traditional, or authorised kigo. Kigo often require to be "re-authorised" yearly, so new kigo might be trialed through the year in journals, and then there is the anticipation to see whether the major saijiki (kigo almanacs) incorporate them. Sometimes a kigo published one year is dropped the following year or following years. The seasonal aspect to haiku in Japan, through designated kigo, is still a main feature of haiku.

Other schools in Japan might either do ultra-contemporary, gendai, non-kigo, or a mix. Folklore and mythology are of course strong in Japan and their language systems (plural) allow for much more content and whole quotes from poems etc...

Eastern European haiku were famous for explicating the wars when Yugoslavia broke up, with intense realism rarely seen before, even in anti-WWII haiku from Japan.

Check out hadaka: all that comprises life:
https://www.thehaikufoundation.org/forum_sm/index.php?topic=2130.0

With the internet, Twitter, and Facebook, for starters, people from various countries would expand their approaches. African haiku is often interesting because they focus on their national or personal culture:
https://www.thehaikufoundation.org/omeka/files/original/45bbf38ca68bb214b04e4476bdb0b9a2.pdf

I've witnessed from India over three decades, where they struggled with moving aside from their world literature supreme epic poetries, into 'pocket' verse such as haiku and senryu. Dr Angelee Deodhar and K. Ramesh (male) were frontrunners and slowly slowly Indian haiku became world-beating and world-winning haiku dominating global haiku.

Now for the last few years it's been African haiku, and I was involved years ago with the Kenyan wave of haiku, not always seen globally, but despite all the odds, coming through. Now Ghana, Nigeria, and other African countries are strong!

Who knows what country from Africa, or an entirely different continent is next?  And of course most of us only read haiku in English, and not Romance languages (France, Italy etc...).

There'll be a wave of Urdu poetry, from Pakistan mostly, coming soon. Stay tuned!   8)


Perhaps parts of the U.K. such as England, which is quieter place for haiku in comparison with Wales and Northern Ireland? Scotland also had strong haiku writers who have either passed away, or stepped down.

As Marion Clarke is from Northern Ireland, I'd love to hear more about that part of Ireland!

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on December 31, 2019, 05:18:41 AM
I would appreciate insights on the differences in haiku of different countries. For example, some of Japanese haiku have a surreal tone which is not present in the haiku in United States. The haiku in United States focus on emotional resonance while Eastern European haiku have an incline towards the mystic and nature. I've also observed that Indian haiku are social in nature. I would appreciate your views on this.

I would appreciate insights on the differences in haiku of different countries. For example, some of Japanese haiku have a surreal tone which is not present in the haiku in United States. The haiku in United States focus on emotional resonance while Eastern European haiku have an incline towards the mystic and nature. I've also observed that Indian haiku are social in nature. I would appreciate your views on this.

I am curious what are the favorite haiku of the members and who are your favorite haiku poets- both classical and contemporary?

When I started writing haiku, I referred to the list of kigo for inspiration. Then the Red Moon Press anthology Echoes inspired most of my haiku. Also I read online journals like The Heron's Nest. A practice I follow when I am feeling uninspired to write a haiku is to write the haiku from various platforms whether books, PDFs or online journals for which I feel most strongly in a diary. It ensures the required pause before getting ready to write while at the same time we don't feel unproductive for not being able to write something new. Also, I feel Russian poetry and short stories (especially Chekhov, Gogol and Turganev) have beautiful imagery to inspire a haiku.

Dear marion, I loved your sequence in Bones. Pure brilliance!

Quote from: AlanSummers on March 15, 2019, 07:08:17 AM
Bones - journal for contemporary haiku no. 16
March 15th 2019
http://bonesjournal.com/no16/bones-16.pdf

One of my students has a number of haiku in there for the very first time! :-)

Wonderful work by our very own Marion Clarke! Her work in Bones is astonishing and there is more than one way to read the words and lines. Superb and powerful work!

Work by new THF member Ray Caligiuri as well; and John McManus!

And lots more!!!

Sir, till now I have only read the PDF file now but I have a few doubts. The initial concept of Yugen indicated aristocratic elegance and grace, as in the example quoted of a picture of aristocratic ladies watching a tree full of cherry blossoms. This is quite unlike the Yugen we perceive today. Our Yugen is more inspired by Basho where Yugen is a single petaled plum blossom in icy field. It is worthwhile to note that then Japan was observing a power transfer from aristocracy to warrior class hence the samurai values of beauty in nothingness were gaining popularity than aristocratic values of elegant beauty. Also, there was the emergence of Zen which travelled from India via China whose core value is emptiness. Is it possible the Yugen we imagine today is different from the initial Yugen? One thing which is common in the definitions of Yugen from both historical periods is that Yugen is something which is beautiful, but we can't put a finger on what makes it beautiful. It is sublime if we refer to Basho's era but as in the PDF, it was not so always. Earlier Yugen was both overt and covert. I would appreciate what the Haijins in this forum think about it.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 05, 2019, 03:57:58 PM

Quote from: XYZ on April 05, 2019, 06:58:08 AM
I would appreciate your views on Yugen. I would very much like to work on my haiku to imbibe this Japanese aesthetic, but it always remains so elusive. Wabi and sabi is also difficult but Yugen is something out of reach. I cannot understand it properly. Is it only evoked by terms like fog, mist, night, shadows. How can we imbibe Yugen in our writing?

Transition of the Concept of Yugen: A Note on
Japanese Aesthetics
https://kuscholarworks.ku.edu/bitstream/handle/1808/1139/CEAS.1971.n10.pdf


https://www.thehaikufoundation.org/juxta/juxta-1-1/karumi-matsuo-bashos-ultimate-poetical-value-or-was-it/

Two to keep you busy for a while!

Alan

I would appreciate your views on Yugen. I would very much like to work on my haiku to imbibe this Japanese aesthetic, but it always remains so elusive. Wabi and sabi is also difficult but Yugen is something out of reach. I cannot understand it properly. Is it only evoked by terms like fog, mist, night, shadows. How can we imbibe Yugen in our writing?

It resolves my confusion completely. Thanks a lot Sir.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 02, 2019, 04:20:38 AM
Bill Higginson explains it really well:


A SENSE OF THE GENRE, A SENSE OF THE LANGUAGE
William J. Higginson
http://www.haikuworld.org/begin/whigginson.sep2003.html

Excerpt:

Most English words ending in '-ing' are either nouns or partial verbs, called 'present participles'. Such nouns seem relatively rare in haiku, as they usually suggest an abstract level of thinking.

The last word of that sentence is a good example of the '-ing' form as noun; grammarians call it a 'gerund'. When a gerund does show up in a haiku, it had better have an article in front to prevent it from being understood as a verb:

evening fog . . .
whispering of mothers
quiets the children

Can't you just hear the fog going around whispering about mothers? Simply putting 'the' before 'whispering' would eliminate the problem. (See what telegraphese does to a haiku?)

A present participle can get a haiku in trouble. The worst are participles without grammatical subjects (and therefore 'dangling'). Since participles can appear before—and change the meanings of—nouns, one lacking a subject before it normally refers to what follows. A penchant for omitting subjects often yields ludicrous results, of which the modest author may be quite unaware:

choking, coughing,
the moon shining over
the quiet lake

Heard the moon cough lately? Much better to give the action to a third person, and put the verbs in the plain present tense:

he chokes and coughs . . .
the moon shines over
the quiet lake

A SENSE OF THE GENRE, A SENSE OF THE LANGUAGE
William J. Higginson
http://www.haikuworld.org/begin/whigginson.sep2003.html

An extremely important link about what matters in a haiku. I've bookmarked it. Thank you Sir.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 01, 2019, 07:47:33 AM
Some people get confused over what is a gerund, and confuse certain present participles etc...

Jane Reichhold (two 'h's):
https://poetrysociety.org.nz/affiliates/haiku-nz/haiku-poems-articles/my-favourite-haiku/favourite-haiku-by-jane-reichhold/

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on April 01, 2019, 06:29:45 AM
I've recently read the techniques of haiku by Late Ms. Jane Reichold Ma'am. She wrote that author's intervention should be minimum in haiku, e.g. instead of writing 'I listen', she would use 'listening' to eliminate the 'I'. But few weeks before, I've read we should not use gerund in haiku. Which path would you advise to follow- gerund or no gerund?

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 01, 2019, 07:47:33 AM
Some people get confused over what is a gerund, and confuse certain present participles etc...

Jane Reichhold (two 'h's):
https://poetrysociety.org.nz/affiliates/haiku-nz/haiku-poems-articles/my-favourite-haiku/favourite-haiku-by-jane-reichhold/

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on April 01, 2019, 06:29:45 AM
I've recently read the techniques of haiku by Late Ms. Jane Reichold Ma'am. She wrote that author's intervention should be minimum in haiku, e.g. instead of writing 'I listen', she would use 'listening' to eliminate the 'I'. But few weeks before, I've read we should not use gerund in haiku. Which path would you advise to follow- gerund or no gerund?

I've recently read the techniques of haiku by Late Ms. Jane Reichold Ma'am. She wrote that author's intervention should be minimum in haiku, e.g. instead of writing 'I listen', she would use 'listening' to eliminate the 'I'. But few weeks before, I've read we should not use gerund in haiku. Which path would you advise to follow- gerund or no gerund?

Thank you, Sir. I agree the waiting period for haiku journals is remarkably less than other mainstream journals. I have also noticed that the editors are a lot more helpful and responsive. I have submitted my short stories earlier to some journals and didn't get any response before six months and the response was too an automated one.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 01, 2019, 05:22:00 AM
Hi Pragya,

Congrats on your honourable mention by the way! :-)

war anniversary
her daughter knows
each star by name

Pragya Vishnoi
Kanpur, INDIA

re Frogpond, I believe it's only Michael Ketchek dealing with submissions, unless you heard from someone assisting him?

Michael Ketchek <mketchek@frontier.com>

Although it's unusual in haiku circles to have to wait long, I've waited 2-3 months at least once or twice, it's nothing compared to a regular 6 months or even an entire year in the general/mainstream poetry journals. :-)

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on April 01, 2019, 05:13:31 AM
Thank you Sir. Actually when I submitted last time, there was an acknowledgement sent so I was worried if my Email reached them or not. But you are right that I should wait. Maybe they have stopped sending acknowledgements now and directly send rejection/acceptance mails after going through the submission.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 01, 2019, 04:13:33 AM
Dear Pragya,

Submission periods are one month long: March for the spring/summer issue.
Acceptances will be sent shortly after the end of each period. Please submit only once per submission period.
http://www.hsa-haiku.org/frogpond/submissions.html

I'm not aware that many magazines/journals send any emails confirming receipt, only if the work is accepted or not.

It is now only April 1st, so submissions sent throughout  all of March will start to be looked at.

Please be patient.

kind regards,

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on April 01, 2019, 03:38:01 AM
I submitted to Frogpond journal on March 29, 2019 but I didn't get acknowledgement for it. Thinking my email was not delivered, I re-sent the mail on March 30 and March 31. Still I didn't get acknowledgement. I am confused if my submission has not reached the journal. How can I know whether my submission is received or not? If it was not received, can I submit it's haiku for a contest?

Thank you.

Thank you Sir. Actually when I submitted last time, there was an acknowledgement sent so I was worried if my Email reached them or not. But you are right that I should wait. Maybe they have stopped sending acknowledgements now and directly send rejection/acceptance mails after going through the submission.

Quote from: AlanSummers on April 01, 2019, 04:13:33 AM
Dear Pragya,

Submission periods are one month long: March for the spring/summer issue.
Acceptances will be sent shortly after the end of each period. Please submit only once per submission period.
http://www.hsa-haiku.org/frogpond/submissions.html

I'm not aware that many magazines/journals send any emails confirming receipt, only if the work is accepted or not.

It is now only April 1st, so submissions sent throughout  all of March will start to be looked at.

Please be patient.

kind regards,

Alan

Quote from: XYZ on April 01, 2019, 03:38:01 AM
I submitted to Frogpond journal on March 29, 2019 but I didn't get acknowledgement for it. Thinking my email was not delivered, I re-sent the mail on March 30 and March 31. Still I didn't get acknowledgement. I am confused if my submission has not reached the journal. How can I know whether my submission is received or not? If it was not received, can I submit it's haiku for a contest?

Thank you.

I submitted to Frogpond journal on March 29, 2019 but I didn't get acknowledgement for it. Thinking my email was not delivered, I re-sent the mail on March 30 and March 31. Still I didn't get acknowledgement. I am confused if my submission has not reached the journal. How can I know whether my submission is received or not? If it was not received, can I submit it's haiku for a contest?

Thank you.

 Thank you.

Quote from: light pilgrim on February 17, 2019, 12:19:15 PM
Hi XYZ,

While THN and Frogpond do accept poems workshopped in a forum like the one on this website, there are other journals that categorically do not consider poems posted on personal blogs, forums etc. Eucalypt, the tanka journal and cattails (haiku, senryu, tanka, haiga and haibun) are two such examples. Skylark, another leading tanka journal states that once accepted the poem/poems "must not be shared online prior to the issue going to print. f you do so, your tanka will be withdrawn from the print issue."

It is always worth reading the specific submission requirements of the journals you want to submit to and if in doubt, ask the editor.



light pilgrim

Thank you Sir.

Quote from: John McManus on February 08, 2019, 03:31:02 AM
No, poems posted in private workshops are classed as unpublished as they are not viewable from a simple google search which means that they are not in the public domain from a publishing point of view. You're safe to send any of your work that you've shared on this or any other forum to THN or Frogpond.